Good morning
As reported yesterday we are starting a little group to write an alternate ending to the Red John story.
Please email me at Jake.Muso@gmail.com if you are interested in participating.
Thanks
Good morning
As reported yesterday we are starting a little group to write an alternate ending to the Red John story.
Please email me at Jake.Muso@gmail.com if you are interested in participating.
Thanks
Hi everyone
At this point I think we can say that there has not been much support of the way Red John's story played out.
I came upon an idea yesterday to start a group of fan fiction writers to write an alternative ending to the Red John story. But I can not track down whoever posted the idea.
I am however very interested in this and I am inviting everyone who wants to take part in it to please email me on Jake.Muso@gmail.com
Thanks
I see many complaining about the pigeon thing.
I think that Bruno meant to let Patrick use this "cheap" trick because after all these years of trying all these well thought out plans and traps he failed to get Red John with, he went "back to basics" and just outsmarted him with a small cheap trick.
How would you have liked this to happen though?I also wanted a showdown but if you think about it they can't have a gunfight, or a sword fight or argue each other to death. Endless dialogue would have made it stale. The trick Patrick use was right up his alley and he knew it's something RJ wouldn't expect.
I only feel that the execution of the trick was a bit rushed from a writing point of view. We don't truly see where the pigeon comes from and the way it starts is truly unrealistic:
Patrick: "Can I show you something?"
RJ: "Sure" *Walks over and holds out his hand . . . uhm DUH!
The rest of the RJ reveal sequence I really don't mind. It was poetic and it was a fitting end.
The writers have from the beginning of this series had poetry as a huge theme and in my opinion this episode ran like poetry.
There was this monster created by years of hype and mental torture, but he comes to Patrick in the form of a man. A mere man, weak and afraid of death.
I think also that in a continuation of the Bible-themed season we've had so far, it may have been the overall idea of the writers to show the "lucifer" of the series Red John be defeated by good, Patrick Jane and then beg for forgiveness. Patrick passed judgement on Red John. He says to Red John that he is an evil man.
Revelations, if I am not mistaken, speaks of a dove that brings peace. Maybe that is where the pigeon comes in. And the church and all of the symbols we have been given in this season.
I think you get my idea.
In short, I think that the reason the episode played out the way it did was because of a central theme the writers followed with the Red John story. He was a "beast" that deceived men and fooled nations to follow him. But he came in the form of a man, who when finally brought to judgement, sought forgiveness and mercy.
Many would have loved a creepy character be revealed as Red John and the episode be an amazing showdown. I also would have loved that.
But the ending that we were given is a satisfying one when you look at how well that theme was carried forward.
If you look at the poetry, the symbolism and take a step back to see the bigger picture, the Red John story was a brilliant masterpiece and the end was the Revelations of this story.
William Blake's poetry and art dealt mainly with religion and Heaven and Hell, and God and the devil.
The next episode is also appropriately titled "My Blue heaven".
Take all of that in and you will come to the realization that Bruno Heller wrote and created a masterpiece of a story.
Someone mentioned on this site yesterday to create a group where we can kind of write our own "Fan Fiction" type ending to the Red John story.
Please email me at Jake.Muso@gmail.com
I am very interested at taking part in this.
Someone mentioned on this site yesterday to create a group where we can kind of write our own "Fan Fiction" type ending to the Red John story.
Please email me at Jake.Muso@gmail.com
I am very interested at taking part in this.
Hey everyone
Yesterday I had a huge rant after seeing the long awaited reveal. I felt disappointed because like many others on the site I felt like no closure was given in terms of many clues and observations we made over the past 5 season.
However, last night after rewatching the episode, I realized that even though they picked someone who may not be anyone's first choice to be Red John, the ending of this saga was truly poetic.
Jane's expression when the sheriff walked in was one of relief that his search has come to an end. He knew that this is the man he had been looking for for 10 years. Nothing else mattered.
Everyone, including me, was angry that Jane declined the opportunity to get answers from Red John. But if you think about it, Jane is there with a plan, he wants to throw this man off of his game, this man expected Jane to want answers but Jane had to throw him off of his train of thought so that he can't see the pigeon trick coming nor the gun that Jane hid in the church in the previous episode (it is not shown but obviously that is how he planned it).
Then we have to see Patrick chasing this man, and see Red John have these escape opportunities like the school bus right there but not be able to get away. Jane finally has him where he wants him, in his sights, wounded and just beyond the reach of an escape.
Finally Jane catches him and in my opinion, when McAllister pleads for mercy, it's an ode to Bruno saying that we will be disappointed in the end, he will be just a man, not an amazing monster with god-like features, but he is a man who is like most men afraid of death. He wanted to bring this man who fans saw as a powerful leader of many, who can have men killed, evidence covered up, people freed from prison to be seen as the everyday man he actually was. In 10 minutes he brought a man who claims to have the life of thousands at his hands, down to a everyday guy begging for his life. This is Bruno's design and I salute him for sticking to his guns.
Jane kills Red John by strangling him, it's intimate and he wants to feel this man's life slip away. He wants to feel the man who took his family struggle for his life.
I read last night a blog by Bruno Heller talking about the idea with the final sequence where Jane runs away. He runs past all these extras and it is said that the Director placed them there to show Jane running from everything Red Jonh took from him , we see a lady and her daughter, an old man and his wife holding hands and then a father playing with his daughter.
Rewatching the episode and taking into account that they can't be expected to provide answers for 5 and a half years worth of mystery and conclude the story in 42 minutes, and also when you take in to account the absolute brilliance in the poetry and feeling you get from this episode you appreciate it as an ending.
And even though most of us would like to have seen someone else be Red John, I can say that I finally made peace with the Red John we were given.
Thanks
PS. Now that we know whoisredjohn, let's turn the site into "www.whokilledbriangriffin.com"
Hey guys
It was a lot of fun doing this. Over the past two or so years I've been coming here submitting a few theories. I've accused Jane's father, Brett Partridge, Bret Stiles, I have seen the light in accusing Gale Bertram. But never once did I accuse Sheriff McAllister and I still will not.
A while ago I stopped accusing altogether. I realized that this show has gone from a carefully written and sculpted story, to a last minute decision written show.
A while back in one of my posts here I mentioned Bret Stiles and how I think he may be Red John and a comment from another user was "He does not fit Rosalind's description" and "Where does he fit into 'He is mar'". Well I said maybe the writers have abandoned those clues long ago with Timothy Carter. And I think they have. I think the Roy Trafalergo and physical descriptions, the 'He is Mar' and everything in between will be loosely attributed to Timothy Carter's Red John.
I loved this show, and I followed it closely. As much as I want to honor my love for the show, these last few episodes and the conclusion of the Red John saga was disappointing and feels extremely rushed. I guess Bruno did not lie about the list and all that, but the scary part is, in short he said screw everyone who wants answers because we are running from Red John as quickly as possible.
In my opinion, Red John was Brett Partridge in season 1, then CBS ordered another season so Bruno said "Wait, let's drag it out a bit". After another two seasons, they decided going back to Partridge was going to be weak, so let's make it a random creepy guy that no one has ever seen before. That should entertain the audience. And they pulled it off, Timothy Carter, to me, was a satisfying Red John.
But then, they had nowhere to go. It's like letting go of a child's hand and seeing him not know where to go now. So suddenly, Red John was NOT Timothy Carter who just described in detail how he killed Jane's family, now he has influence over hundreds of people including law enforcement. Suddenly, everything gets explained by "He is a powerful man".
Then the writers (IMO very obviously) randomly selects a few guys, throws them in with a few actual suspicious guys and we get left with 7.
Then they sat with a problem because some of the clues didn't fit. So let's select the most random of the 7, send him into the church as Red John, have Jane decline his offer to give us answers and then plead for his life and go all wimpy before he dies in the same episode he is revealed in.
Looking back, I could have lived with Red John as Timothy Carter. Up until then, I didn't need any answers.
But they pushed it waaaaay too far. Thomas answers no questions.
- He is Mar?
- Rosalind's description?
- Where does he fit in with Patrick?
- He does not seem like an evil genius?
- Where does he fit in with Visualize?
- If he is in Visualize why kill his guru Stiles?
- Why did the Latino go out of his way to keep Bertram alive until the church scene?
- Kirkland's brother?
- Patrick's happy memory?
Even some of the suspects on the list fit the clues better than Thomas.
No turning back though.
Thanks everyone.
It's been fun.